Diff Ratios

Re: Diff Ratios (sir_smeghed)

Wed, 09 Aug 2017 22:49:58 GMT

Thanks for all of your help and suggestions guys.

Re: Diff Ratios (sir_smeghed)

Wed, 09 Aug 2017 22:45:56 GMT

Final update:

I am unable to find a solution that I can actually afford so am sticking with the S54 "as is" and just putting in an LSD.

Unfortunately this is less torque hitting the black stuff than I wanted but it will have to do, I have an Apexi AFC Neo which will allow the Vtec to be tuned to kick in at around 3800 rpm (or so the experts tell me) and an overall tune to expect up to a 20 kw gain at the wheels.

Anyway, I will just have to wait until I get some actual figures. I will add all of this to Thomas's original build thread when I get it done.

https://www.mr2australia.com/mr2play/tm.aspx?m=96882

Re: Diff Ratios (5SGTE)

Tue, 23 May 2017 21:05:49 GMT

" /> Thanks.

Re: Diff Ratios (Knightrous)

Tue, 23 May 2017 14:02:22 GMT

5SGTE
Nobody has mentioned engine mounts with the K20 box. What's the options there?

Buy the Hux Racing kit (US$450).

Re: Diff Ratios (5SGTE)

Tue, 23 May 2017 13:34:24 GMT

Nobody has mentioned engine mounts with the K20 box. What's the options there?

Re: Diff Ratios (WHITBO)

Sun, 21 May 2017 15:33:24 GMT

The E53 will fit into an MR2 using the same brackets and mounts as the E153 BUT the gear shifter linkages will be on the wrong side! My gearbox for the 2grfe conversion is an E53 but uses the rear casing and shifter shaft from an MR2 E153 to swap the gear shifter to the correct side of the gearbox. This involves pulling both E53 and E153 gearboxes to bits and making one gearbox from the two! Note also the driveshafts are different (larger diameter for the E53 and E153, versus the S54). So this also means you need to find the E153 driveshafts, as well as changing your hubs. Lots of work and $$.

Re: Diff Ratios (sir_smeghed)

Sat, 20 May 2017 14:39:47 GMT

Does the E53 share the same chassis mounting point as the S54? IE. Will it be a direct fit replacement?

Re: Diff Ratios (WHITBO)

Sat, 20 May 2017 13:26:04 GMT

I know on the internet they say E53 were available on 1992-93 Camry's. However I think this is for the US market, and the change to 1MZ-FE V6's much earlier than Australia.

E53's can be found on Australian Camry Vienta's with 3VZ-FE motors thru to about 1997. I bought a smashed up Vienta and used the gearbox for my 2GR-FE conversion, and I'm pulling about 2700 RPM in 5th gear @ 100 KMH with the 3.625 diff ratio. I'm seriously thinking about taking the 0.731 5th gear from the old E153 gear set I have and swapping for the 0.82 E53 5th gear, as this should drop the revs @100 KMH to about 2400 RPM.....maybe do the same for 4th also!

Re: Diff Ratios (sir_smeghed)

Thu, 18 May 2017 17:02:34 GMT

At least that parts easy.... ha ha And that's common for all E series boxes?

I'm having a bit of trouble tracking down an E53 box though, they were on the 92/93 camry and pretty rare as most were sold as auto's.

With the k20 conversion idea, adaptor plates are available for purchase around $300 but there seem to be issues with the flywheel spacers and starter motors. I will keep looking into both ideas.

I can't afford to have the car off the road for more than a day, my wife thinks cars are magical things that fix themselves and don't cost any money so if my car is out of action for a week or two then I have to explain myself. :(

Yes, I hear the whip crack and the sound of your laughter ringing in my ears.

Re: Diff Ratios (Knightrous)

Thu, 18 May 2017 16:46:13 GMT

Gearbox Oil Cooler Loop.

Undo the loop, fit your own oil cooler system.

Re: Diff Ratios (Eric)

Thu, 18 May 2017 16:05:40 GMT

If you have a look at my calculations on page 1, you will see the ratios are fairly close to the hybrid box. the K20 is 67kmh in 1st vs 53kmh for the hybrid box

2nd is 103kmh k20 vs 101kmh
3rd is 144kmh k20 vs 155kmh

As for coolers on E series boxes, there is a steel pipe which runs outside the case on the underside which provides some cooling, however you can splice into this and run an external cooler. This is what my used gearbox had when I first bought it

Re: Diff Ratios (sir_smeghed)

Thu, 18 May 2017 15:50:10 GMT

Gotcha, that makes sense. Whats confusing me is that the E53 and S53 transmission casings share the same part number (neither of which are actually stocked anywhere anymore). I wasn't aware the E series boxes had an internal oil pump, do you know if it is possible to direct the transmission oil flow through a cooler?

I will also look into the K20 option but am pretty sure all of the 6 speed boxes are going to have the same issue, too long.

Any thoughts about the driver side drive shaft clearance issue? Or is this not an issue with the turbo drive shafts?

Re: Diff Ratios (Knightrous)

Thu, 18 May 2017 15:27:38 GMT

sir_smeghed
My research has indicated that the E53 and the S53 are the same box with different gearing, the S53 is the predecessor to the S54 and internally are fully compatible. Does this sound right? If so then your research would suggest that the E250F final gear set is a direct fitment into the S54?

I'm going to say no based on the following:

The E-series boxes all share a common diff size that can be swapped. You can take a diff from an E51 AW11 SC gearbox and fit it into an E153 SW20 Turbo gearbox. You can also fit it into an E58 AE101 Corolla gearbox.

None of the E series diffs work in an S-series gearbox. The only diff that does fit in an S series is a C-series. It's very common for people to steal a torsen diff from a C56M or C60 gearbox and fit it into an S54.

The E-series gearboxes feature an internal oil pump driven from the output shaft. The S-series gearboxes all rely on the diff flicking oil onto a catch tray. And since you require the output shaft to be swapped with a crown wheel for a diff swap (To maintain PCD and bearing spacing like Falcon mentions), you will not get that to work between an E250F and an S54...

Re: Diff Ratios (Eric)

Thu, 18 May 2017 13:42:41 GMT

I'm 99% confident that E series internals are vastly different to S series.

Not trying to shoot down ideas here, but after a few years in the MR2 game I am a strong believer of following the simplest route.

The simplest route to me appears to be an adapter plate and a 6 speed K20 box. You get very good ratios and a cruising rpm in 6th of 3200rpm at 100km/h.

The risk of mixing and matching internals is that you end up with two gearboxes in need of some repair, such as worn syncros or bearings, then you have to replace these parts. Labor time is going to be fairly expensive too.

If I was in your position I would buy the adapter plate, a good condition used K20 box and applicable driveshafts are needed to make this work. The only hurdle in this instance would be reversing the shifter cables on the gearbox end, however I am sure there is an aftermarket solution available.

Anyway, that's just my 2c. Feel free to take that as you please :)

Re: Diff Ratios (sir_smeghed)

Thu, 18 May 2017 11:02:21 GMT

I get your concerns Falcon, which is why I felt to need to share a bit of my history so you guys know I'm not just some hack. I'm very patient and meticulous and will follow a trail of breadcrumbs as far as it will lead me. :)

Damn Knightrous! If I don't owe you a carton of beer by the end of all this then there is no justice in the universe!

My research has indicated that the E53 and the S53 are the same box with different gearing, the S53 is the predecessor to the S54 and internally are fully compatible. Does this sound right? If so then your research would suggest that the E250F final gear set is a direct fitment into the S54? I know there is no cheap option but I'm also balancing the cost V's delivery, I may have to sacrifice something to safe a few pennies.

Will I also need to address the driver side drive shaft clearance issue Thomas was faced with?

The E53/E250F hybrid DOES look like it would be an exceptional budget track day box, probably best bang for buck.

Also, I found some more interesting reading:
http://www.celicatech.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-54182.html?s=8f38b97d3909796140c2e5274c1010bf

There are definitely options out there, I find myself spending a lot of time on the Celica forums... They do a lot of cool stuff to their cars.